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RaZ Vader
06-28-2012, 06:39 AM
I guess I will jump on the band-wagon and ask the community a feedback question as well. This one is fairly simple. I noticed some people were thinking we can improve this in the feedback poll Spartan posted.

What Can the Factions of FC do to make Forerunner Conflict feel more like a War-Like Battle On Sundays? What Can the War-Council Do?

We currently use a battle map, have Military Ranks, Squads or Units you play with, training, boot camps. Is there anything else that we can possibly do to make our community feel more milteristic on Sundays or any other way in the Army?

If you feel we are doing a good job already, do not even bother responding. But if you have any suggestions, please post them.

MedeDust
06-28-2012, 07:30 AM
Try having some more war-like-feeling maps. Also from what I've played during a battle it sounds more like we're playing a sport rather than fighting a war, not really sure how to fix that.

Something that has been trailing my mind, territories, have we been using this much? I'm thinking of maybe making it like conquest like BF3 or MW3.

VerbotenDonkey
06-28-2012, 09:14 AM
Has to do with peoples attitudes as well. If people don't want to treat it like a warsim, it won't be. Attitude is the biggest thing, we can do everything we can to make it a warsim on the outside, but if people don't treat it like one, then it won't feel like one. I see no distinction between Units (what makes a Unit stand out from another? Emblems, mottos, pride?). We have a really cool warmap and idea set up but it just feels like we're playing RISK, not fighting a War.

Officers should have a more serious role. I feel like most Officers just act like Enlisted with a higher rank. The Officer spot really lost its luster. I'd rather see the Sergeant ranks actually do more, like leading Fire Teams within a Platoon, and see less Officers.

Ill type more later, I'm mobile now.

Blackhawk570
06-28-2012, 09:31 AM
I play for the competitiveness. Company structure and roles are enough to make it feel like a warsim for me. I feel like the LARP represent the warsim more than the actual battlenights and if other people believe that then the number difference between the two favor the FC battlenights over the warsim feeling.

Puba
06-28-2012, 10:41 AM
The maps should have a more military feel to it . Every time I play in battle night I feel like the tactics are the same . People rush power weapons while a couple of people go to the flanks and a couple down the middle . I mean it's fun but It doesn't feel like a war sim . If we had a urban map like a city it would make scence .some maps could have explosion happing above while we fight . Also when we post the attack plans we make a little story for example redd attacks a blue controlled city you make this the story: " The rebel scum have taken the city and using it as a key supply route , We must take it back !" or something along the lines .

UNLUCKY NUM13ER
06-28-2012, 11:25 AM
Officers should have a more serious role. I feel like most Officers just act like Enlisted with a higher rank. The Officer spot really lost its luster.

I feel like this is spot on, we need more officers (REDD & BLUE) to take their positions seriously and make FC a unique experience for everybody.

Gargoyle
06-28-2012, 12:13 PM
Officers, return of A.I.'s and galaxy news, maybe a ceremony at the end of each war. Video'd cease fire type thing. LARP to return and stay active.

The warmap def needs a kick to it. Like, it's too x and y feeling. Maybe the option of a few different units with different powers or something more strategy like.

Mythonian
06-28-2012, 12:20 PM
The warmap def needs a kick to it. Like, it's too x and y feeling. Maybe the option of a few different units with different powers or something more strategy like.

*cough*

That'd complicate things quite a bit...

But you've got my gears turning. :)

SuRroundeD By 1
06-28-2012, 01:31 PM
Outside of the battles FC definitely acts like a war-sim. We're all granted ranks, we have to go through boot camps, there are attack plans, officer meetings, etc. However, another important aspect of "war-sim" is game play, and when we actually go to a battle night the war-sim aspect kind of disappears and turns into a competitive match against our fellow war-sim buddies.

War Simulations are difficult to describe . . . I made a post in Reapers thread earlier and in that post I stated that realism and Competitiveness cannot go hand in hand. In order for FC to truly become a war-sim it has to account for realistic war-like features, which would most likely ruin competitive game play. Think about it, in real war, battles aren't going to be fought on small sized battle zones like Reflection or Triton, there going to be fought on large battlefields with air and vehicle support and etc. In real war, both armies might not start off equally matched, in fact, one side might have a complete advantage on the other, but that same factor would ruin competitive game play; whose soul essence is basically fair and balanced game play, fairness which means equal spawns. While FC is largely a war sim within the community, the battles (in my opinion at least) are not.

To be honest though, I highly doubt FC's battles can "truly" get that war-sim feel. Largely because of the player count. The only game on Xbox that I've ever played that made me actually feel like I was in a war was Battlefield 3 (because of the large player count and the tons of vehicles). On the PC, Project Reality was the best war simulator I have ever played . . . but it was too realistic and it was very slow. 16 players on a decently large sized map still doesn't cut it for me . . . doesn't feel like a war.

I'm sure that I could list more, but I don't feel like thinking of any.

Don't get me wrong guys I love FC, and I can see myself being here for a long time. The battles can be EXTREMELY fun and satisfying but they do not feel like a war-sim.

Everything else feels like a war sim though :)

Coda
06-28-2012, 01:51 PM
One thing FC could do, is add invasion type games to it. I don't know if this was brought up before or not, but I think it would be pretty cool if the REDD actually had to invade Tritan rather than just "ok, everyone fight". And I agree that attitudes definitely have a lot to do with it. If you're not serious about the war feel of it, it won't feel like a war sim. This is especially important for unit leaders. When you have a group of people looking up to you, and you don't take it seriously, they won't either. But if you are big on the war sim feeling, then they will be too

Acid
06-28-2012, 01:58 PM
Make me Supreme Commander of REDD Army.

VerbotenDonkey
06-28-2012, 02:03 PM
One thing FC could do, is add invasion type games to it. I don't know if this was brought up before or not, but I think it would be pretty cool if the REDD actually had to invade Tritan rather than just "ok, everyone fight". And I agree that attitudes definitely have a lot to do with it. If you're not serious about the war feel of it, it won't feel like a war sim. This is especially important for unit leaders. When you have a group of people looking up to you, and you don't take it seriously, they won't either. But if you are big on the war sim feeling, then they will be too

Its been suggested but then one Team would have to be Elites.

bazongaman502
06-28-2012, 03:56 PM
i think you are about as close as you can get to a "War-Sim"... bigger maps would be great (currently building one)

Coda
06-28-2012, 04:02 PM
Its been suggested but then one Team would have to be Elites.

Are you sure? I havent messed with the controls for invasion, but I thought you could have spartan v spartan and elite v elite invasion games. If one would have to be elites, then we shouldn't have it

Mythonian
06-28-2012, 04:06 PM
Are you sure? I havent messed with the controls for invasion, but I thought you could have spartan v spartan and elite v elite invasion games. If one would have to be elites, then we shouldn't have it

That's only for the Invasion Skirmish or Invasion Slayer modes. With actual objective invasion, it it always Spartan vs Elite.

VerbotenDonkey
06-28-2012, 04:09 PM
That's only for the Invasion Skirmish or Invasion Slayer modes. With actual objective invasion, it it always Spartan vs Elite.

^ that lol

Coda
06-28-2012, 04:11 PM
Dang. Well that sucks. Never mind then. I don't think the rebels will suddenly become aliens so I guess that wont work.

Graycochea
06-28-2012, 07:16 PM
We could introduce storylines? I'm just brainstorming here, but maybe 8 people volunteer to be Elites. Then, 4 BLUEs and 4 REDDs seeing they're outnumbered, would team up to fight off the Elites. Proximity voice. It totally works. Little things like that. A team of 4 REDDs surrenders to the BLUEs and the other 4 REDDs have to rescue them. I'm not saying we should script the whole War, but just do some things that would happen in an actual War. Maybe a BLUE General joins the game and a REDD taskforce is sent to assassinate him. And little changes based on outcomes. Elites win, more people can join their ranks, if they so wish. REDDs aren't saved and are executed or something they can't play next week, General gets assassinated and has to leave the game. Like I said I'm just brainstorming. Also, like everyone has been saying, it's just balls out fighting. A plan is made during black screen and everyone charges into the fray. Something should be done to 1. See if anyone wants that to change and 2. If enough people do, figure out a way to make it happen. An honor timer for going out onto the battlefield maybe. I would very much like to experience this LARP everyones been talking about.

Gargoyle
06-28-2012, 10:52 PM
The story idea def should happen. I doubt anyone of the newer people even know both the armies acronyms than the story behind FC's fiction.

Graycochea
06-29-2012, 01:10 AM
I'll try without looking it up.

Royal Enforcer Deployment Division

Brotherhood Legion of United Exiles

I don't know the backstories though. :(

Salvanous
06-29-2012, 01:23 AM
I know I always tell my recruits what BLUE stands for in my bootcamps.

Guzzie
06-29-2012, 01:44 AM
You can't mess with battle nights in order to make the sim more war like. Some one put it very nicely in a previous post, you can't have the battles be competitive/balanced and be perfectly war like realism. The war like realism should be kept to everything outside of battles. Examples being: make bootcamps more structured (more military like), people of certain ranks to act accordingly (officers behave like officers, enlisted as enlisted), maybe bring back emblem specific ranks? (people must wear their emblems/ranks to any official FC event), practices/meetings/events could be treated more professionally, add stories to attack plans.

I am all for making the sim be more war like, but do not mess the battles in order to do so, it will only cause problems. People already complain when a map gives one team a slight advantage, and doing so purposely will only damage the entire structure of the battles (winning a certain amount of maps/gametypes in order to attack the capital).

VerbotenDonkey
06-29-2012, 02:00 AM
I agree with everyone, even though I'm one of the biggest pushers for as much WarSim as possible, you cannot really change anything about the actual battles. Halo just wouldn't play right if it wasn't played "competitively" in that sense. The biggest thing that can be done is aestheticals with the Maps themselves, main thing being make it look like an actual War. Have the Maps reflect that. Maybe starting spawns are inside a Pelican or forged Vehicle, and then the respawns are littered around the base. However, you can't really change the pace of the game.

If anything, the main things for me are: each Platoon/Unit should have a dedicated Emblem that they wear during battles/practices/meetings to identify themselves. Otherwise, there really isn't much recognition about what makes each Platoon different. They should stand out more, and the easiest way is to have an Emblem to dictate that, so if a new member joins my lobby, I can recognize, Oh he's a Hellhound, instead of just seeing a random emblem and not knowing anything about the person. Now I'm all for individualization with people, however if they're going to invest time into the WarSim, I think they should want to feel more like a "team" and share an Emblem and have some pride in their Unit.

Each section of ranks should also have responsibility. Officers should have weekly reports to write, whether it be a summarization of the days practice, a Formal Report to their Superiors about detailed analysis of their Unit, etc. Perhaps have Squad practice once a week, then a weekly Platoon Practice, weekly Battalion practice, and a weekly skirmish. So you're mingling with different people all the time.

Overall, I think we've definitely reached a new high point for the WarSim influence. Its all just little things now.

Anarchy
06-29-2012, 02:11 AM
The problem with this not feeling like a war is the connection we make from the battles we play to the results we see.


Lets face it, the problem isn't with the games we play. It's halo, it will play like halo, and the competition will be like halo. But if we continue simplifying battle results as "This army won more games", we will see lackluster war feeling.

In a nutshell, to make this feel like a proper war without stepping on anyone's toes, add a newspaper/reporter. The newspaper could have multiple writings in them, with one main article talking of how REDD or BLUE marched on while the side articles list various happening in FC as newspaper, wartime articles. "Infamed general of BLUE army Mededust retired today, a ceremony was held at the capital with Field Marshal Anarchy giving a speech and awarding a medal of honor. Close friend Colonel Yehsus was seen crying as the former lieutenant general flew off towards his vacation home back on Earth with his loving wife, etc. etc....."

Most people wouldn't care much for an actual ceremony, they'd easily change the mindset to what battle nights are. People will not role play events to make things feel war sim like.

I know you guys had similar things in the past, but as I think about it I'm starting to warm up to the weekly newspaper with multiple articles in it idea...

Acid
06-29-2012, 08:37 AM
No one listens to my suggestions. Damn you all!

SuRroundeD By 1
06-29-2012, 02:30 PM
No one listens to my suggestions. Damn you all!

No, we listened to it, but no one cared enough to say anything "Supreme Commander" :P

Guzzie
06-29-2012, 05:22 PM
To all those proposing to make the maps feel more "war like" by adding details, remember, the more items, weapons, vehicles, and objects you add to a map, the more frame rate lag you will encounter in said map. You have to compromise, either have a simple map that plays well, or a fully detailed map in which you can't zoom in because it will be laggy. I would much rather have simple, smooth playing maps than one that lags. Some people were even complaining about Tritan and how much it lagged. I would say keep the level of detail to a reasonable level.

Yehsus
06-29-2012, 05:42 PM
The problem with this not feeling like a war is the connection we make from the battles we play to the results we see.


Lets face it, the problem isn't with the games we play. It's halo, it will play like halo, and the competition will be like halo. But if we continue simplifying battle results as "This army won more games", we will see lackluster war feeling.

In a nutshell, to make this feel like a proper war without stepping on anyone's toes, add a newspaper/reporter. The newspaper could have multiple writings in them, with one main article talking of how REDD or BLUE marched on while the side articles list various happening in FC as newspaper, wartime articles. "Infamed general of BLUE army Mededust retired today, a ceremony was held at the capital with Field Marshal Anarchy giving a speech and awarding a medal of honor. Close friend Colonel Yehsus was seen crying as the former lieutenant general flew off towards his vacation home back on Earth with his loving wife, etc. etc....."

Most people wouldn't care much for an actual ceremony, they'd easily change the mindset to what battle nights are. People will not role play events to make things feel war sim like.

I know you guys had similar things in the past, but as I think about it I'm starting to warm up to the weekly newspaper with multiple articles in it idea...

False.

Acid
06-29-2012, 06:22 PM
False.

Shutup Yehsus.

Coda
06-29-2012, 07:23 PM
I definitely agree with what donkey was saying. It is so easy to see who's in REDWATCH because of the emblem. If I see someone I'm not familiar with, I have no idea what platoon they're in. Also, having a newspaper like report of the battle would be very cool. I would love to read that.

Gargoyle
06-29-2012, 07:45 PM
Shutup Yehsus.


Loco's back!

Raider0614
07-01-2012, 03:05 PM
Who knows what level of epic epicness this community can achieve if it were to experiment with uncommon map ideas and succeed in maintaining a fun, balanced game. I admit, i'm tired with the standard maps with your designated power weapons and this "Sports Arena" feel to it. I say FC could kick it up a notch if someone were to design a different kind of map. This is just an example but maybe have an open battlefield and two bases at each end. Power weapons are located in each of the bases and maybe put a Territory in the center of the battlefield. We can also bring Michael Bay into the picture and place a bunch of vehicles at each base. The beginning to every battle on this map would be Lord of the Rings battle epic as the two armies clash at the middle. Just an idea. The point is though that taking on new, innovative map ideas is worth a shot. I rather we try and fail than stay with the old because we are too scared to try anything new.

SuRroundeD By 1
07-01-2012, 05:43 PM
Who knows what level of epic epicness this community can achieve if it were to experiment with uncommon map ideas and succeed in maintaining a fun, balanced game. I admit, i'm tired with the standard maps with your designated power weapons and this "Sports Arena" feel to it. I say FC could kick it up a notch if someone were to design a different kind of map. This is just an example but maybe have an open battlefield and two bases at each end. Power weapons are located in each of the bases and maybe put a Territory in the center of the battlefield. We can also bring Michael Bay into the picture and place a bunch of vehicles at each base. The beginning to every battle on this map would be Lord of the Rings battle epic as the two armies clash at the middle. Just an idea. The point is though that taking on new, innovative map ideas is worth a shot. I rather we try and fail than stay with the old because we are too scared to try anything new.

Sounds a lot like Hemorrhage with a territory in the middle haha.

Honestly, I feel that territories is the only real game type that feel's like war.

Coda
07-02-2012, 02:37 AM
Sounds a lot like Hemorrhage with a territory in the middle haha.

Honestly, I feel that territories is the only real game type that feel's like war.
Territories definitely feels like a war. Slayer can too though. If played on a good map, Any gametype can though. I think there should be some experimentation with maps. I think we could, like raider said, really kick it up a notch if we get it to feel more like a real war.

bazongaman502
07-02-2012, 02:41 AM
have maps that expand all the way across Forge World.... we have a big area and have yet to really do alot with it. Only small areas are used. Reall battle expand miles, yet we keep it to little patches

SuRroundeD By 1
07-02-2012, 12:16 PM
have maps that expand all the way across Forge World.... we have a big area and have yet to really do alot with it. Only small areas are used. Reall battle expand miles, yet we keep it to little patches

Right but there isn't too much you can do about that either. If we expand a map too much to where it takes a while to even find someone on the enemy team than the map might get a little boring. Another problem with that is vehicles become necessary and some players don't like vehicles. Although, people are testing out maps soon for the next war, so if you want you should try creating a large battlefield to test.

Here are my suggestions:

- Build the map knowing how large it's going to be first (is it going to expand as far as it can, or is it going from the beach to the cave? etc).

- Decide what kind of vehicle warfare you want to include. Certain vehicles WRECK others, the most over powered being the Scorpion Tank and Gauss Warthog, if you include either of those be wary of flying vehicles, basically, they will be rendered useless. BUT if you only want to focus on vehicle warfare than it doesn't matter, maybe you only want tank battles dominating the grounds, just know what your making.

- Include area's of interest, like objectives, large hideouts/ buildings, advantage points, etc. These area's could give the players who don't like vehicle warfare and option to get on foot.

I'm not a forger myself but these are common rules. I'm sure you probably already know what your doing but I'm just making sure because I can't tell you how many maps I've seen that bend one of these rules, and the map ends up being crappy. I'm sure there are more but again, I'm not a forger, these are just the big three I can think of.

J05hu498
12-19-2012, 05:09 PM
I guess I will jump on the band-wagon and ask the community a feedback question as well. This one is fairly simple. I noticed some people were thinking we can improve this in the feedback poll Spartan posted.

What Can the Factions of FC do to make Forerunner Conflict feel more like a War-Like Battle On Sundays? What Can the War-Council Do?

We currently use a battle map, have Military Ranks, Squads or Units you play with, training, boot camps. Is there anything else that we can possibly do to make our community feel more milteristic on Sundays or any other way in the Army?

If you feel we are doing a good job already, do not even bother responding. But if you have any suggestions, please post them. I think bigger maps would help

purple gamer 17
12-19-2012, 06:16 PM
I think bigger maps would help
^

Metkil5685
12-19-2012, 06:21 PM
Holy necro post.

Please note this thread was meant for feedback to improve the wars after the last Reach war. All feedback related to the wars now should be posted in the appropriate Battle Results (http://fcwars.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?134-Battle-Results) thread, or creating a new topic (http://fcwars.net/forums/newthread.php?do=newthrea d&f=6) here in the suggestion forum.

Due to the necro post, I will be closing this thread.

Good day.

Metkil5685
Website Administrator